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ps47
Skilled

Slovakia
1463 Posts

Posted - 26/06/2004 :  14:21:25  Show Profile  Visit ps47's Homepage  Send ps47 an AOL message  Send ps47 an ICQ Message  Reply with Quote
hmm,my english is probably worse that I thought
I will try to put it as simple as I can.
I'm running hitman contracts demo on my voodoo3 3500tv.
I use opengl and mesafx.
mesafx6.1.0.4 works fine,you must ENABLE SW rescaling to fix white textures,and DISABLE TEXUS2.if you do this,the game runs and looks the way it should.

if you leave texus2 on,all textures are just a black mess.

with mesafx6.1.0.5 or newer I have disabled texus2,but the textures remained black (posted pictures,page 25 of this topic)

it looks like I cant disable texus2 with 6.1.0.5 or newer..



The 3Dfx Helppage and Game Guide / Voodoo3/4/5 enviromental variables
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dborca
Average

Romania


425 Posts

Posted - 26/06/2004 :  14:35:28  Show Profile  Visit dborca's Homepage  Send dborca a Yahoo! Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by ps47

all textures are just a black mess.
That's what I wanted to know!

Regards,
Daniel Borca

Edited by - dborca on 26/06/2004 14:37:05
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dborca
Average

Romania


425 Posts

Posted - 28/06/2004 :  11:18:27  Show Profile  Visit dborca's Homepage  Send dborca a Yahoo! Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by ps47

with mesafx6.1.0.5 or newer I have disabled texus2,but the textures remained black

Do you mean the intro screen always looks like this?
http://www.3dfxzone.it/enboard/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=1107
I'm not sure they are supposed to look like that all of the time. I mean there are some flashing effects, but the overall screen should remain blackish.

Regards,
Daniel Borca
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ps47
Skilled

Slovakia
1463 Posts

Posted - 28/06/2004 :  12:50:52  Show Profile  Visit ps47's Homepage  Send ps47 an AOL message  Send ps47 an ICQ Message  Reply with Quote
you are right,the main menu looks that way only during that flashing effect (lightning strikes outside).the main menu should look like this most of the time:
Image Insert:

73.59KB
as you can see,there is no graphic corruption,the room is a bit darker but still good visible..(just for the record,vodooo3 3500tv,with mesafx6.1.0.4.,sw rescalling on,texus2 off)

The 3Dfx Helppage and Game Guide / Voodoo3/4/5 enviromental variables

Edited by - ps47 on 29/06/2004 11:34:40
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dborca
Average

Romania


425 Posts

Posted - 29/06/2004 :  08:55:50  Show Profile  Visit dborca's Homepage  Send dborca a Yahoo! Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by ps47

as you can see,there is no graphic corruption,the room is a bit darker but still good visible..(just for the record,with mesafx6.1.0.4.,sw rescalling on,texus2 off)

Hmmm... it seems that Hitman Contracts pumps precompressed S3TC textures into OpenGL, based only on the faint assumption of GL_EXT_texture_compression.

OpenGL spec does not bind GL_EXT_texture_compression to any specific format whatsoever, so this technique is really disgusting. That is, GL_EXT_texture_compression might exist, but the renderer might choose to provide FXT1 only, for example.

Bad OpenGL coding exists everywhere, and is unfortunate that we, driver developers have to deal with such things...

Other examples:
BloodRayne demo: does check for WGL_ARB_render_texture/WGL_ARB_pbuffer, but right after the test (and regardless of its result) it jumps into WGL_ARB_pbuffer routines. Hmmm... Also tries to use 4 TMUs, regardless of the OpenGL limits.
ONI demo: by some magic (and contrary to any OpenGL techniques) it fetches the function pointers of BlendColor and assumes GL_EXT_blend_color is present.
Savage2 demo: well, it blindly assumes GL_EXT_vertex_buffer_object, GL_EXT_texture_compression and GL_S3_s3tc.
UT2004 demo: issues some cube_map commands, even if cube mapping is not available.

I'll try to think of a workaround for Hitman Contracts. I still don't know how it's crashy on Napalm. What's the drill with screenshot?

Regards,
Daniel Borca

Edited by - dborca on 29/06/2004 12:02:13
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ps47
Skilled

Slovakia
1463 Posts

Posted - 29/06/2004 :  11:43:06  Show Profile  Visit ps47's Homepage  Send ps47 an AOL message  Send ps47 an ICQ Message  Reply with Quote
cant help you much with napalm.the game is unstable,I cant even make a screenshot (using hypersnap,it works fine on the voodoo3),because the game crashes instantly.usually crashes when I try to change the graphic setings as well..

The 3Dfx Helppage and Game Guide / Voodoo3/4/5 enviromental variables
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dborca
Average

Romania


425 Posts

Posted - 29/06/2004 :  12:22:15  Show Profile  Visit dborca's Homepage  Send dborca a Yahoo! Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by ps47

cant help you much with napalm.the game is unstable,I cant even make a screenshot (using hypersnap,it works fine on the voodoo3),because the game crashes instantly.usually crashes when I try to change the graphic setings as well..
Whether it crashes when you try to take a HyperSnap screenshot is not a criterion. It did not crash on my Napalm. Ever. Try to use other Glide3x libraries to see where theproblem is.

ATTN everybody on this thread:
It's a general rule of thumb that people always bitch about Mesa, even when other software is faulty (either be it directx part of the driver, or third party software). Well, it works the other way, too: maybe Mesa is doing things right and the others don't. I'm not paid to accomplish full compatibility with every d@mn piece of software in the world. I'm not paid at all. However, I WILL continue MesaFX support, just for fun. I don't say that MesaFX is bugfree. Au contraire... But, before making assertions about buggy MesaFX, /PLEASE/ try everything that's possible to eliminate other sources of errors. I might be able to workaround conflicts with certain software, but I need something more than: "omigosh! it crashed".

Regards,
Daniel Borca
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mikepedo
Novice

Italy
32 Posts

Posted - 29/06/2004 :  20:15:53  Show Profile  Visit mikepedo's Homepage  Reply with Quote
A question:

Temporal AA in V5 6K is possible?
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Kokohemmo
Novice



21 Posts

Posted - 29/06/2004 :  20:40:36  Show Profile  Visit Kokohemmo's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Hi all...
I had those crashes/hangups in games too, but just in D3D games..
When I took Enable Write Combining in display settings off, all D3D games don't crash/hang anymore...

Maybe this is old news but anyway..

I use XP and AM 3.0 with Mesafx in V56K

Regards
Kokohemmo
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bloodworm
Average

USA


278 Posts

Posted - 29/06/2004 :  23:01:44  Show Profile  Visit bloodworm's Homepage  Reply with Quote
dborca,
if you can give us more stuff like:

quote:
Hmmm... it seems that Hitman Contracts pumps precompressed S3TC textures into OpenGL, based only on the faint assumption of GL_EXT_texture_compression.

OpenGL spec does not bind GL_EXT_texture_compression to any specific format whatsoever, so this technique is really disgusting. That is, GL_EXT_texture_compression might exist, but the renderer might choose to provide FXT1 only, for example.

Bad OpenGL coding exists everywhere, and is unfortunate that we, driver developers have to deal with such things...

Other examples:
BloodRayne demo: does check for WGL_ARB_render_texture/WGL_ARB_pbuffer, but right after the test (and regardless of its result) it jumps into WGL_ARB_pbuffer routines. Hmmm... Also tries to use 4 TMUs, regardless of the OpenGL limits.
ONI demo: by some magic (and contrary to any OpenGL techniques) it fetches the function pointers of BlendColor and assumes GL_EXT_blend_color is present.
Savage2 demo: well, it blindly assumes GL_EXT_vertex_buffer_object, GL_EXT_texture_compression and GL_S3_s3tc.
UT2004 demo: issues some cube_map commands, even if cube mapping is not available.


Then we the people of 3dfxzone can work on the game developers to make the game comply (via patches) with the openGL rules that they are supposed to be doing in the first place! some of us are here to help in any way we can.

Bloody Mess
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amp_man
Experienced

545 Posts

Posted - 30/06/2004 :  07:07:10  Show Profile  Visit amp_man's Homepage  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by bloodworm

dborca,
if you can give us more stuff like:

quote:
Hmmm... it seems that Hitman Contracts pumps precompressed S3TC textures into OpenGL, based only on the faint assumption of GL_EXT_texture_compression.

OpenGL spec does not bind GL_EXT_texture_compression to any specific format whatsoever, so this technique is really disgusting. That is, GL_EXT_texture_compression might exist, but the renderer might choose to provide FXT1 only, for example.

Bad OpenGL coding exists everywhere, and is unfortunate that we, driver developers have to deal with such things...

Other examples:
BloodRayne demo: does check for WGL_ARB_render_texture/WGL_ARB_pbuffer, but right after the test (and regardless of its result) it jumps into WGL_ARB_pbuffer routines. Hmmm... Also tries to use 4 TMUs, regardless of the OpenGL limits.
ONI demo: by some magic (and contrary to any OpenGL techniques) it fetches the function pointers of BlendColor and assumes GL_EXT_blend_color is present.
Savage2 demo: well, it blindly assumes GL_EXT_vertex_buffer_object, GL_EXT_texture_compression and GL_S3_s3tc.
UT2004 demo: issues some cube_map commands, even if cube mapping is not available.


Then we the people of 3dfxzone can work on the game developers to make the game comply (via patches) with the openGL rules that they are supposed to be doing in the first place! some of us are here to help in any way we can.



Haha, that's a good one. In order for that to happen, the game developers would first have to ADMIT they did something wrong, and that SOMEBODY ELSE figured it out before they did. They, they would have to develop patches for it! And of course, that's in order to support good old 3Dfx hardware, stuff they really don't care about and has been lost from their "official support" list for, oh, about 3 1/2 years now! No offense, but I don't see it happening.
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dborca
Average

Romania


425 Posts

Posted - 30/06/2004 :  08:08:53  Show Profile  Visit dborca's Homepage  Send dborca a Yahoo! Message  Reply with Quote
I'm uploading release candidate4 today, at my situ:
  • added GL_EXT_fog_coord for Voodoo2 and up
  • added GL_EXT_blend_equation_separate for Napalm
As soon as Koolsmoky fixes some win32 interface issues we'll have 6.1.0.9.

@amp
I admit that bloodworm's point of view is somehow idealistic, but I never said those games should support good ol' 3Dfx hardware (that's my job). Just to use OpenGL adequately (that's their job). If they choose chaos, why use an API after all?

@ps47
MESA_FX_IGNORE_TEXUS2 is back in business in rc4.

@Kokohemmo
That is exactly my point. In order to test/use Mesa, people should stick with stable drivers with stable settings.

@mikepedo
TemporalAA was developed on the 6k So I guess it works, but that's done inside Glide, not Mesa. Use the Glide3x DLL that ships with Mesa. Just browse this thread if you don't know how to activate it.

Which brings me to another thing... Since I hate writing docs, FalconFly gave me an idea: this whole thread might be packaged in official Mesa releases, as a substitute for documentation

Regards,
Daniel Borca
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ps47
Skilled

Slovakia
1463 Posts

Posted - 30/06/2004 :  11:28:40  Show Profile  Visit ps47's Homepage  Send ps47 an AOL message  Send ps47 an ICQ Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by dborca

Whether it crashes when you try to take a HyperSnap screenshot is not a criterion. It did not crash on my Napalm. Ever. Try to use other Glide3x libraries to see where theproblem is.

ATTN everybody on this thread:
It's a general rule of thumb that people always bitch about Mesa, even when other software is faulty (either be it directx part of the driver, or third party software). Well, it works the other way, too: maybe Mesa is doing things right and the others don't. I'm not paid to accomplish full compatibility with every d@mn piece of software in the world. I'm not paid at all. However, I WILL continue MesaFX support, just for fun. I don't say that MesaFX is bugfree. Au contraire... But, before making assertions about buggy MesaFX, /PLEASE/ try everything that's possible to eliminate other sources of errors. I might be able to workaround conflicts with certain software, but I need something more than: "omigosh! it crashed".



you are right,of course.I was not trying to complain,I was trying to give some feedback.apparently I'm not too good at it.now I feel miserable,everyone comes here to say how great mesafx is and I'm the only one that keeps bugging.I apologize for being such an annoyance.
mesafx is the best thing ever and I will not complain no matter what..

ok,enough.tested hitman contracts on my voodoo3,and it works now,just good as 6.1.0.4 if not better..

The 3Dfx Helppage and Game Guide / Voodoo3/4/5 enviromental variables
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dborca
Average

Romania


425 Posts

Posted - 30/06/2004 :  17:06:23  Show Profile  Visit dborca's Homepage  Send dborca a Yahoo! Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by ps47
[brI apologize for being such an annoyance.
mesafx is the best thing ever and I will not complain no matter what..
It's ok. I was addressing to everyone around. It seemed to me a general trend.

quote:
ok,enough.tested hitman contracts on my voodoo3,and it works now,just good as 6.1.0.4 if not better..

Great!

Regards,
Daniel Borca
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ps47
Skilled

Slovakia
1463 Posts

Posted - 30/06/2004 :  17:39:05  Show Profile  Visit ps47's Homepage  Send ps47 an AOL message  Send ps47 an ICQ Message  Reply with Quote
tested hitman contracts on my voodoo5 as well,and everything seems to be ok now,no more crashes.sounds like my config was the culprit,however osckhar had the same probs.hmmm..

The 3Dfx Helppage and Game Guide / Voodoo3/4/5 enviromental variables
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